In more recent video Alton trashed Shun because of some business deal that went bad... That really sucks because I own Shun knives and they are fantastic.
I sharpen my own knives and have become the family professional and no one complains since any sharper edge is better than compared to 5 minutes before when they couldn't cut anything
This is kinda funny to watch considering the massive changes in steel and the understanding them in the past 10-20 years. VG-10 used to honestly be a super steel but nowadays it's honestly a pretty mid tier steel. Still better than what most people are used to but miles off even entry level super steels.
Today there are a plethora of knife sharpening systems you can buy. I would recommend whet stones only. I have a set of Japanese whet stones that work very well on my Shuns. For those that fear they won't get the correct angle there are mechanical systems that hold the knife in place at the proper angle while you work the stone across them.
yeah true that! so many chefs i know talk so much smack about Shun, but they just dont know how to use it haha. First off, you arent supposed to CHOP at all with these knives, and once you sharpen it proper - the edge lasts a while. I do sushi full time 90 hrs a week with my Shuns, i love them so much because the VG Max steel core is all that matters! thats some high end Samurai materials right there. I use a 1000/3000 combo stone, then finish with my 6000 grit stone, and lastly I top it off on my 8000 grit Norton Whetstone which costs more than the knife haha. They get stupid sharp once you know what your doing. I can literally fillet salmon in two strokes, both sides with my Shun knifes. its impressive how effortless it is once you master whetstone sharpening! 16 degree bevel is very easy, I sharpen it 16 on the inside and 12 degrees on the outside (16/12 is roughly 70/30 bias) The real trick to sharpen these knives, and all other knives on a whetstone is to use your left hand for the backside, and dont push up against the grain if ya know what i mean! 10 years as a sushi chef has taught me a lot lol ambidextrious sharpening is a highly recommended skill to learn, and no one else in the world even knows how to do this it seems like! haha The straight parts are obviously easy to do, but for the curved parts - you have to develop some mad muscle memory to make it look easy, follow through with a round swing as you push it down to the stone, and that tip will be the sharpest part of the blade, 100 percent! i gotta upload a video tho
8 years I've owned 4 from the Classic line and send them away to sharpen every other year. Just got them back today as a matter of fact, love a sharp edge right after sharpening, these will last the rest of my life
The only thing I've ever seriously disagreed with Alton on is sharpening knives. If you know how to sharpen a pocket knife or a straight razor, you know how to sharpen a kitchen knife.
Much more accurate than Gordon Ramsay's knife "sharpening" tutorial. Ramsay just gets it wrong from the start, as far as all other tutorials I've watched prove. Maybe everybody's wrong except the "ants in his pants" Gordon.
Anybody here own them? I do and they handle great and cut great when I'm in peak condition. However, they are heavy used, thin edged knives of a decent knife steel with a major downside. It's brittle as F. If you don't baby the edges, then you get enough chips in them to wonder if it's serrated. I would LOVE a budget shun in a cheaper softer tougher steel.
Thank you Alton, you made me a believer! I went to Sur La Table (in Ann Arbor, MI), there they let you try out the knives before you purchase it. I took my son along with me, and he too plans to purchase a Shun knife. Do you recommend the block set of classic knives or should I buy them individually? What about the premier line of knives?
George Meads I would recommend buying individually, because the odds of needing every knife in the set is low. You really only need a chef knife, a paring knife and a serrated knife for bread. The serrated can be something less expensive. I love my victorinox and it was about 40 dollars. filet knives are needed if you will be working with alot of whole fish. boning knife are great for breaking down large cuts of meat and you guessed it boning. I would say an often over looked part of a knife set is a proper Whetstone and steel. no matter how nice the knife is it's no good if it isn't sharp. I'd prefer a sharp 40 dollar knife to a dull shun or anything else. hope this helps.
Kitchen knives are one of those things that you just don't cheap out on, like shoes or mattresses. Go ahead and get the Shun. You will be glad you spent it up front than two or three times for lesser articles.
I found a six-blade set of Shun on eBay for @ $250. There are some almost imperceptible blemishes on the handles but they still cut like a 1st class Shun!
noctbot just buy a shun chef knife and maybe a nice paring. I'd get a serrated from victorinox, they cost about 40 bucks. You dont really need all the knives included in large sets. but I would recommend a nice chef knife. in reality any knife will work if it is well sharpened and taken care of. a nicer knife will just take and hold that sharp edge better and longer.
I'm a little unsure about the Victorinox serrated knives. The serrations aren't very 'depthy' compared to others. They almost seem more a good carving knife than a bread knife... are you still around? ... thoughts? ... anyone?
If you're not really into knifes or don't use them on a daily basis for work or otherwise I wouldn't. But if you're a cook and have to use knifes everyday all day they're totally worth it.
+Thumber Pasta Why? Alton does commercials all the time for Food Network. This infomercial is both instructive and well-produced and well-paced...like all of his shows. He's passionate about his knives. He's been a 'bladehead' all his life.
Max Savino vg-10 is a super steel, its just not for foemost super steel anymore. 440C used to be considered a super steel. but its now been overshadowed by the likes of vg-10 and s90v 154cm etc
test18258 I would take 440c any day over vg-10 personally, or 154cm, which is just modified 440c. I guess this video is just old, because you certainly don't hear the steel snobs talking about how great vg10 is. VG-10 is the one steel i've had the most chipping issued with, especially when it comes in the form of a spyderco knife.
Max Savino I cant say that ive had chipping issues with any of my knives, but at the same time im a "casual" knife user, the majority of things that I cut with my knives includes, boxes, food, stray threads, and sheets of paper. ill be sure to look out for that on my spyderco endura if I ever start using it to cut real stuff.
These are the knives I bought for culinary school and they are amazing. Yeah I spent a pretty penny but they are sharp and cut like the day I bought them and that was 4 yrs ago.
Are you sure Wusthof is 14 degrees, Harper? The general info available tells me that European edges are 22 degrees while Asians have 15 or less although there is a trend towards the Asian edge despite this tradition. As to AB and being paid... doubt it. People buy because of his praise and manufacturers are keenly atuned to this legendary Foodie. The selection of product on AB's research has to reflect a common consumer price range; he teaches the masses, not the pros. There are very, very good products out there in an expense range that reaches to the stratosphere, he isn't going to waste time on this because the true afficionado is going to seek that info on his own. Plus, the technology and industry competition will change rapidly in this fluid state. There seems to be no end to the current popular interest in food preparation nowadays with plenty of room for every pocketbook. No conspiracy here....
+Trish Fitzpatrick Wusthof redesigned their edge in 2010 to what they now call the PETec edge, which is in fact 14 degrees on each side (28 total). Prior to 2010 they were sharpened to 20 degrees on each side (40 total). This history is documented at the following link: www.metrokitchen.com/wusthof-history This video was produced before the change was made so Alton wasn't just saying it because he was getting paid. European knives have traditionally been sharpened to 20-22 degrees and Wusthof followed this pattern until very recently. On a side note, Alton was most definitely being paid to do this. He even had his own line of Shun knives at one point (Alton's Angle or something like that). Having said that, I don't believe he would've done this if he didn't believe in the products. Shun make excellent knives as do many other companies. Alton, along with any other self-respecting chef, would not be caught dead with a full set of knives from any one company. If you were a Good Eats fan, you'd see that he did use several other brands for other knives (slicer, boning, etc.). I really miss that show.
+Harper Zapf yeah it's almost like this was some kind of advertisement and alton brown was contacted by them to display the knives or something i think you're onto something though gotta stop the presses for this ground breaking revelation!
I love my blades but i've noticed a small chip .. hate to think where that ended up.. sucks that there is no where in my country to have them sharpened
research japanese waterstones and learn how to sharpen them yourself. i consider it a small investment considering the cost of typical high-quality japanese knives.
Don't get me wrong, I'm a big AB fan, but it seems his research team fell down on one thing here. The "heat and chemicals" explanation is a common one for why good culinary knives should not go in the dishwasher, but if it were true, a lot of other kitchen items would be reduced to smoking goo, and long before hardened steel would be affected. I wondered about this, did some research, and was told by a blademaker that what is actually bad about the dishwasher is that the water action in them batters things around in there a bit, and the blade of your expensive knife might spend the entire ride banging repeatedly against a ceramic bowl, for example. Then, of course, there is the handle issue. A lot of handles will eventually dull and crack if they are washed in the dishwasher a few times. But blades aren't harmed a bit by the heat or chemicals in a dishwasher.
Remember that the heat and chemicals are only weathering the very thin cutting edge. It really does not take all that much to over heat that leading edge.
I'm a knife nerd too. I've tried a bunch of different types of knives. Shuns keep a nice edge. But I don't think they hold a candle to RyuSen. RyuSen has the same great layered Pakka wood handle that is impregnated with resin to keep water from ruining the handle. The quality of the metal is better with RyuSen than it is with Shun. A RyuSen knife is lighter and cuts better than a Shun. And one thing he forgets to mention is balance, which is quite important. A lighter knife with good balance makes cutting so much easier because your hand/wrist has to do less work. With many knives when you try a long knife, it feels awkward due to poor balance. However even a 300mm (11.75") RyuSen knife doesn't feel awkward in my hands. Ditch the Shun and buy a better knife. Buy a RyuSen.
Well if we are arguing the "Best"... than you should have no problem justifying a $3,000 (and up) Bob Kramer... this is of course per knife I am talking, not a block.
So, I don't get it... Did Shun approach Alton Brown and say "Hey! We really love Good Eats, and really dug your episode on knifes. Will you do an infomercial in that style?"
Just became the owner of a Ken Onion edition Chef's knife by Shun. Very happy with this knife. The damascus steel is beautiful, and the edge is as amazing as you'd expect.
Okay, Uh, heh... Yeah. Funny story. I looked up the price for these knives, and a single 8" chef-style is $130 bucks. That is for the 'classic' version. If you want the premiere, then it goes up to $180. The 8 piece set is $600. I do not make enough food at home to even come close to spending an entire months rent on these knives--as amazing as they undoubtedly are.
It is definitely expensive and I have a cheaper knife right now as a beginner but if you do a lot of cooking it would be the main thing in use. Less than $200 for something that'll last 10+ years and you use every day isn't so bad. Most people only need a few knives and not a big set either (even Alton Brown in his books recommends buying knives individually for what you need and starting with around 3 kinds (chef, paring, etc). The rest just makes particular things easier and aren't really needed).
I cut my finger badly the other night on my first Shun knife. Be aware!
I like a little humor mixed in with my informative videos, thank you.
A1
I brought a Shun to learn how to sharpen header steel knifes. I'm getting there. :D
In more recent video Alton trashed Shun because of some business deal that went bad... That really sucks because I own Shun knives and they are fantastic.
Alton and Shun had a disagreement, and now he won't even say their name.
I sharpen my own knives and have become the family professional and no one complains since any sharper edge is better than compared to 5 minutes before when they couldn't cut anything
I loved my Shun knives before I knew Alton Brown made this video, but I love them even more now.
He doesn't love Shun so much anymore...
This is kinda funny to watch considering the massive changes in steel and the understanding them in the past 10-20 years. VG-10 used to honestly be a super steel but nowadays it's honestly a pretty mid tier steel. Still better than what most people are used to but miles off even entry level super steels.
Today there are a plethora of knife sharpening systems you can buy. I would recommend whet stones only. I have a set of Japanese whet stones that work very well on my Shuns. For those that fear they won't get the correct angle there are mechanical systems that hold the knife in place at the proper angle while you work the stone across them.
yeah true that! so many chefs i know talk so much smack about Shun, but they just dont know how to use it haha. First off, you arent supposed to CHOP at all with these knives, and once you sharpen it proper - the edge lasts a while. I do sushi full time 90 hrs a week with my Shuns, i love them so much because the VG Max steel core is all that matters! thats some high end Samurai materials right there. I use a 1000/3000 combo stone, then finish with my 6000 grit stone, and lastly I top it off on my 8000 grit Norton Whetstone which costs more than the knife haha. They get stupid sharp once you know what your doing. I can literally fillet salmon in two strokes, both sides with my Shun knifes. its impressive how effortless it is once you master whetstone sharpening! 16 degree bevel is very easy, I sharpen it 16 on the inside and 12 degrees on the outside (16/12 is roughly 70/30 bias) The real trick to sharpen these knives, and all other knives on a whetstone is to use your left hand for the backside, and dont push up against the grain if ya know what i mean! 10 years as a sushi chef has taught me a lot lol ambidextrious sharpening is a highly recommended skill to learn, and no one else in the world even knows how to do this it seems like! haha The straight parts are obviously easy to do, but for the curved parts - you have to develop some mad muscle memory to make it look easy, follow through with a round swing as you push it down to the stone, and that tip will be the sharpest part of the blade, 100 percent! i gotta upload a video tho
Broken Shun? Send us a photo, we can recondition or even buy them! info@exactblade.com Northbrook Illinois. Authorized Shun Retailer.
Great explanation of how I should be caring for my Shun. I feel guilty now. Thanks for teaching me how to hone my favorite culinary tool.
I came here to see if I could find out why you hate shun now.
Shun screwed over Alton. Don't be like Shun.
8 years I've owned 4 from the Classic line and send them away to sharpen every other year. Just got them back today as a matter of fact, love a sharp edge right after sharpening, these will last the rest of my life
do you send them to Shun or your neighborhood sharpener guy!
Alton FUCKIN' Brown
All the work to make this video and he cant pronounce shun correctly. And he is a self professed blade head. Other then that I like the video.
I didn't knew you can hone you shun knives. Mostly I am honing Steels 58 hrc or less. Any opinions? Should I get a hone for my shun?
Avoid honing rods. Just use a stropping setup
I was "shunned" away by their "D-shaped" handles 😢
Only on the classic line
Metall on Metall niiiiccccccce move
miyabi?????
The only thing I've ever seriously disagreed with Alton on is sharpening knives. If you know how to sharpen a pocket knife or a straight razor, you know how to sharpen a kitchen knife.
Much more accurate than Gordon Ramsay's knife "sharpening" tutorial. Ramsay just gets it wrong from the start, as far as all other tutorials I've watched prove. Maybe everybody's wrong except the "ants in his pants" Gordon.
I love my blue steel better. :)
I just bought my first Shun knife. Thanks for the professional, informative, and entertaining video.
Anybody here own them? I do and they handle great and cut great when I'm in peak condition. However, they are heavy used, thin edged knives of a decent knife steel with a major downside. It's brittle as F. If you don't baby the edges, then you get enough chips in them to wonder if it's serrated. I would LOVE a budget shun in a cheaper softer tougher steel.
OH MA GAAAD HE CUT RIGHT THRU A TOMAATOO
A million likes for this information , very useful.
"superior steel" too bad shuns are known for chipping out haha. VG10 isnt that great in a chef knive in my opinion.
Miyabi
Ren Birk yo
wow, this is one tough crowd.
Excellent tutorial. Thank you.
Definitely don't run with a Shun...
Thank you Alton, you made me a believer! I went to Sur La Table (in Ann Arbor, MI), there they let you try out the knives before you purchase it. I took my son along with me, and he too plans to purchase a Shun knife. Do you recommend the block set of classic knives or should I buy them individually? What about the premier line of knives?
George Meads I would recommend buying individually, because the odds of needing every knife in the set is low. You really only need a chef knife, a paring knife and a serrated knife for bread. The serrated can be something less expensive. I love my victorinox and it was about 40 dollars. filet knives are needed if you will be working with alot of whole fish. boning knife are great for breaking down large cuts of meat and you guessed it boning. I would say an often over looked part of a knife set is a proper Whetstone and steel. no matter how nice the knife is it's no good if it isn't sharp. I'd prefer a sharp 40 dollar knife to a dull shun or anything else. hope this helps.
WOH 840$ for a 7 piece set. I think Ill keep shopping. For that price they had better cook the whole dinner for me.
Kitchen knives are one of those things that you just don't cheap out on, like shoes or mattresses. Go ahead and get the Shun. You will be glad you spent it up front than two or three times for lesser articles.
I found a six-blade set of Shun on eBay for @ $250. There are some almost imperceptible blemishes on the handles but they still cut like a 1st class Shun!
noctbot just buy a shun chef knife and maybe a nice paring. I'd get a serrated from victorinox, they cost about 40 bucks. You dont really need all the knives included in large sets. but I would recommend a nice chef knife. in reality any knife will work if it is well sharpened and taken care of. a nicer knife will just take and hold that sharp edge better and longer.
I'm a little unsure about the Victorinox serrated knives. The serrations aren't very 'depthy' compared to others. They almost seem more a good carving knife than a bread knife... are you still around? ... thoughts? ... anyone?
If you're not really into knifes or don't use them on a daily basis for work or otherwise I wouldn't. But if you're a cook and have to use knifes everyday all day they're totally worth it.
Jamie oliver is a cult makeover for the real world
To see Alton Brown doing a commercial is kind of disappointing.
+Thumber Pasta Why? Alton does commercials all the time for Food Network. This infomercial is both instructive and well-produced and well-paced...like all of his shows. He's passionate about his knives. He's been a 'bladehead' all his life.
What is his name? I forgot it
+Seok un Jang Alton Brown.
Yes because vg10 is a "super steel" haha. NOPE
Max Savino yea there is better steel now but this vid was probably like 10 years ago cause look how young Alton Brown is!
Max Savino vg-10 is a super steel, its just not for foemost super steel anymore. 440C used to be considered a super steel. but its now been overshadowed by the likes of vg-10 and s90v 154cm etc
test18258 I would take 440c any day over vg-10 personally, or 154cm, which is just modified 440c. I guess this video is just old, because you certainly don't hear the steel snobs talking about how great vg10 is. VG-10 is the one steel i've had the most chipping issued with, especially when it comes in the form of a spyderco knife.
Max Savino I cant say that ive had chipping issues with any of my knives, but at the same time im a "casual" knife user, the majority of things that I cut with my knives includes, boxes, food, stray threads, and sheets of paper. ill be sure to look out for that on my spyderco endura if I ever start using it to cut real stuff.
These are the knives I bought for culinary school and they are amazing. Yeah I spent a pretty penny but they are sharp and cut like the day I bought them and that was 4 yrs ago.
9 years later, do you still have them?
@@RyanEugeneKelley I guess he is gone!
Wusthof Classic knifesnarensharpened at a 14 degree, thinner then shun injust feel like he was paid to do this.
Are you sure Wusthof is 14 degrees, Harper? The general info available tells me that European edges are 22 degrees while Asians have 15 or less although there is a trend towards the Asian edge despite this tradition. As to AB and being paid... doubt it. People buy because of his praise and manufacturers are keenly atuned to this legendary Foodie. The selection of product on AB's research has to reflect a common consumer price range; he teaches the masses, not the pros. There are very, very good products out there in an expense range that reaches to the stratosphere, he isn't going to waste time on this because the true afficionado is going to seek that info on his own. Plus, the technology and industry competition will change rapidly in this fluid state. There seems to be no end to the current popular interest in food preparation nowadays with plenty of room for every pocketbook. No conspiracy here....
+Trish Fitzpatrick Wusthof redesigned their edge in 2010 to what they now call the PETec edge, which is in fact 14 degrees on each side (28 total). Prior to 2010 they were sharpened to 20 degrees on each side (40 total). This history is documented at the following link: www.metrokitchen.com/wusthof-history This video was produced before the change was made so Alton wasn't just saying it because he was getting paid. European knives have traditionally been sharpened to 20-22 degrees and Wusthof followed this pattern until very recently. On a side note, Alton was most definitely being paid to do this. He even had his own line of Shun knives at one point (Alton's Angle or something like that). Having said that, I don't believe he would've done this if he didn't believe in the products. Shun make excellent knives as do many other companies. Alton, along with any other self-respecting chef, would not be caught dead with a full set of knives from any one company. If you were a Good Eats fan, you'd see that he did use several other brands for other knives (slicer, boning, etc.). I really miss that show.
+Harper Zapf yeah it's almost like this was some kind of advertisement and alton brown was contacted by them to display the knives or something i think you're onto something though gotta stop the presses for this ground breaking revelation!
I love my blades but i've noticed a small chip .. hate to think where that ended up.. sucks that there is no where in my country to have them sharpened
research japanese waterstones and learn how to sharpen them yourself. i consider it a small investment considering the cost of typical high-quality japanese knives.
Its pronounced " shoon " not shun
Don't get me wrong, I'm a big AB fan, but it seems his research team fell down on one thing here. The "heat and chemicals" explanation is a common one for why good culinary knives should not go in the dishwasher, but if it were true, a lot of other kitchen items would be reduced to smoking goo, and long before hardened steel would be affected. I wondered about this, did some research, and was told by a blademaker that what is actually bad about the dishwasher is that the water action in them batters things around in there a bit, and the blade of your expensive knife might spend the entire ride banging repeatedly against a ceramic bowl, for example. Then, of course, there is the handle issue. A lot of handles will eventually dull and crack if they are washed in the dishwasher a few times. But blades aren't harmed a bit by the heat or chemicals in a dishwasher.
Remember that the heat and chemicals are only weathering the very thin cutting edge. It really does not take all that much to over heat that leading edge.
Sorry, wrong. If it got hot enough in your dishwasher to do that, all your plastic stuff would be melted goo.
CorneliusSneedley Its not about melting it. Acids with heat added have an a profound effect on steel.
Scott McCullough What acids are you talking about that would be in a dishwasher?
CorneliusSneedley Well the soap is fairly basic and the rinse aid is fairly acidic. Combine that with the heat and you can damage the fine edge.
I'm a knife nerd too. I've tried a bunch of different types of knives. Shuns keep a nice edge. But I don't think they hold a candle to RyuSen. RyuSen has the same great layered Pakka wood handle that is impregnated with resin to keep water from ruining the handle. The quality of the metal is better with RyuSen than it is with Shun. A RyuSen knife is lighter and cuts better than a Shun. And one thing he forgets to mention is balance, which is quite important. A lighter knife with good balance makes cutting so much easier because your hand/wrist has to do less work. With many knives when you try a long knife, it feels awkward due to poor balance. However even a 300mm (11.75") RyuSen knife doesn't feel awkward in my hands. Ditch the Shun and buy a better knife. Buy a RyuSen.
Well if we are arguing the "Best"... than you should have no problem justifying a $3,000 (and up) Bob Kramer... this is of course per knife I am talking, not a block.
So, I don't get it... Did Shun approach Alton Brown and say "Hey! We really love Good Eats, and really dug your episode on knifes. Will you do an infomercial in that style?"
If they did, he wouldn't have done it just for the money. The product had to have passed his muster first. Or however the saying goes.
Thanks, that was informative and amusing.
Just became the owner of a Ken Onion edition Chef's knife by Shun. Very happy with this knife. The damascus steel is beautiful, and the edge is as amazing as you'd expect.
Talk about a cheesy video
Okay, Uh, heh... Yeah. Funny story. I looked up the price for these knives, and a single 8" chef-style is $130 bucks. That is for the 'classic' version. If you want the premiere, then it goes up to $180. The 8 piece set is $600. I do not make enough food at home to even come close to spending an entire months rent on these knives--as amazing as they undoubtedly are.
It is definitely expensive and I have a cheaper knife right now as a beginner but if you do a lot of cooking it would be the main thing in use. Less than $200 for something that'll last 10+ years and you use every day isn't so bad. Most people only need a few knives and not a big set either (even Alton Brown in his books recommends buying knives individually for what you need and starting with around 3 kinds (chef, paring, etc). The rest just makes particular things easier and aren't really needed).